WSB ROUND 1 QATAR TODAY

[Mike Rowley]

I can't see the Japanese manufacturers being greatly interested in WSB, I certainly wouldn't be if I were them. I suspect they will concentrate their efforts on MotoGP where they have a level playing field. The current modification of the rules to enable the twins to run 200cc more is a complete nonsense and solely designed to give Ducati back their unfair advantage again after a short period having to compete on a level ground and largely failing. Anyone ever heard of a Ducati winning the Senior TT?

The engine size, state of tune and bike specification should be the same maximum for all and if some choose to run a twin or a triple then that is their choice. If the rules are rigged to suit a particular manufacturer then the optimum machine will never emerge and machine development is artificially stiffled.

It is clear that twins have an advantage in the way they put the power down and rideability whereas the fours seem to have the advantage in power. Altering the firing order and modifying the torque curves has helped the fours develop a better way of laying down the power and this has been reflected in recent developments with road bikes. Motor GP is tending to indicate that V4 configuration may be the optimum, rather like Formula 1 showed the superiority of V10s until all teams were restricted to V8s. If the major race series for road based bikes is skewed to favour a particular manufacturer, bike development is bound to be restricted and channeled in one direction. This may be seen as a plus for Italian bike fans and Ducati but it is not good for the development of bikes overall.

The racing might be exciting to watch at the moment but I can't help feeling disappointed that Superbike racing has allowed itself to be manipulated by the Italians again just as Ferrari manipulate Formula 1. A race series in which everyone knows which make of bike is going to win before it begins will inevitably become boring, we might as well call it the Ducati SuperBike series Unless of course, Honda decide to play them at their own game again just to prove a point!

Mike

[mattr6]

The Japanese manufacturers can't afford to ignore WSB. It doesn't matter what modifications they have, they are still the closest bikes to road bikes and, as we all know, racing sells. I do agree with you in that the rules do favour Ducati at the moment but theres not a lot in it. As Deej says, the Ducati riders are all top riders- I mean riders far superior to Nieto, Neukirchner, Laconi etc which explains some of the results. Also Bayliss is something els.

It will be interesting when Ten Kate get fully on the pace. From what I can gather, they have only had the bike 1 month and so is woefully undeveloped. Compare that to the new 1098 which has apparantly been lapping Mugello in various guises for the last 12 months!! I would like to see weight penalities added at the next round but I feel that the Honda is the dark horse this year (and Checa is a quality rider when he stays on)

It would be nice if the rules were the same across the board but then, manufacturers would all choose the same configuration (the best within the rules) and we would effectively have a one make/ configuration championship- nobody wants that!!

In my opinion Motogp is going down the F1 route with too much electronics and will be a boring series this year (hope I'm wrong)

[Mike Rowley]

It would be nice if the rules were the same across the board but then, manufacturers would all choose the same configuration (the best within the rules) and we would effectively have a one make/ configuration championship- nobody wants that!!

I would have thought that this is inevitable when you formulate the rules to fit the specification of one manufacturer. This was proven by the fact that when BSB and WSB rules had the twins on 1000cc and four cylinders on 750cc, Ducati won everything and even the RC45 couldn't get near, the parallel fours didn't even get a smell. All of the best riders knew they had to be on a Ducati to stand a chance. Eventualy Honda produced the SP1 and sebsequently the SP2 and beat them at their own game, the point being that the only way to be competetive in the face of such a large capacity advantage was to adopt the V twin format.

It surely follows that this may well happen again therefore all of the manufacturers will have to produce V twins or be content to be also rans. The natural consequence of this is that it mitigates against development of other configurations by artificial means and the optimum doesn't emerge. I would suggest that this inhibits development with implications to road bikes. The adoption of a common set of rules allows manufacturers to develop different configurations within a level playing field and surely this broadens development with benefits for us all.

Enforcing weight on the Ducati to reduce its advantage could well be counter productive as weight can be used to advantage to optimise handling. I suspect teams would prefer a capacity advantage with the scope to move the centre of gravity around easily.

I suppose the fact that an Italian runs WSB and the single tyre choice is Italian has some bearing on this, or maybe I am being too cynical!

Mike

[TLS-Moose]

I say bring back Formula Libre, that used to be run alongside F1 & Endurance rounds ..... anything you like, blank sheet of paper ........ thats how beastie's like the Elf's etc., came into being

To be honest, it's where Moto GP and F1 should be too - the barest minimum of rules, and an anything go's attitude

[mattr6]

The organisers can't really win. If they make all capacities/ configs the same across the board they will lose Ducati. That may not seem like a big loss but it was Ducati who made WSB what it is today. I don't see how the added weight can give them an advantage.

Judging by the first 2 rounds, the advantage isn't that great (apart from Bayliss who looks to be in another championship!!) and when the Honda is fully developed, I'm sure we'll see that up the front. Also most team managers seem happy about it according to MCN (apart from the Yam team boss) Saying that, I would like to see them add weight.

[deej]

mike, put a stock 1098 up against a zx10/r1 and they will walk all over them

the way i see it is theres a few reasons to the results so far this season
1. honda didnt get the wsbk bikes out in europe as quick as what hodgson had his in the states.
2. nieto/neukircher/sufogulo/etc arent a patch on the top guys
3. the yamahas still cant conserve tyres,just like last year

and the most important factor

is that bayliss has more motivation than anyone else as its his final season and he wants a title on the 1098 to add to his collection

honda will get their act together eventually but it will be too late i fear,the pirellis wil never be as good as a michelin/dunlop/bridgestone especially now they have no competition at bsb level to help develop the tyres

[Mike Rowley]

I am not against twins per-sae, I ride a twin and prefer the linear power delivery, relatively flat torque curve, engine braking and easy rideability they give. I just want to see a level playing ground and let development take its natural course without artificial constraints that are clearly designed to favour one manufacturer. From MotoGP it looks very much as if V4s give the optimum between outright power to weight and useable power delivery and V4 road bikes have been very successful, but no one in their right mind would set out to develop a V4 superbike that would start with a 200cc disadvantage.

It is well known that twins are more forgiving to tyres than parallel fours simply due to the way the power is delivered and being able to move weight around to achieve optimum ballance to the bike and rider is a considerable advantage. The amazing power that can be squeezed out of a four cylinder engine is incredible but delivering it in a useable form that doesn't wreck the tyres is more of a challange. The manufacturers have gone some way to solving this with various engine systems but the temptation would always be there to develop traction control systems to solve this problem, then the input of the rider is reduced and the engineer becomes more important.

Given that, I do understand that we engineers, given total freedom will design and develop systems that minimise the input of the rider and as many outside factors as possible. This is clearly not conducive for exciting racing, you only have to look at F1 to see what happens when you give engineers free reign and large wedges of cash. If you put mechanical, electrical and electronic engineers together with computer geeks for long enough and with enough wedge you might as well put a monkey on the bike eventualy. Therefore there is a clear necessity for rules to prevent the ethos of sport being submerged to the geek mentality. I just think it is important to ensure the rules provide for open competition between manufacturers as well as riders and teams for the good of the sport and motorcycle development.

Mike

[mattr6]

I'm sure I've read somewhere that Aprilla's new for WSB bike is going to be a V4. And BMW are entering with an inline 4. Obviously some manufacturers don't see the advantage that twins have.!!

[Mike Rowley]

The organisers can't really win. If they make all capacities/ configs the same across the board they will lose Ducati. That may not seem like a big loss but it was Ducati who made WSB what it is today.

I'm curious to know why you think Ducati would walk away from WSB if the rules didn't favour them? Someone reasoned that the Japanese manufacturers couldn't afford to, surely Ducati sales are much more focused at the race derived end of the market than the Japanese who sell the vast majority of their output in the far East as low capacity commuter machines. The Japs also have a much more broadly based product line from mopeds, scooters, quads, lawn mowers, generators, pumps, compressors, boat engines, jet skis, snowmobiles, cars and in some cases heavy engineering. I would have thought that Ducati have a far greater need for participation in WSB than the Japs.

Personaly, I don't think any of them will walk away. They might well limit factory support to supply of parts and just leave it to the private teams thus concentrating their factory efforts where they have a level playing field. That is largely what they did with BSB. The Japanese seem to be concentrating their main factory effort on MotoGP these days and who can blame them.

It is not surprising that the best riders end up on Ducatis, this is what happened previously when the Vtwins had a 250cc advantage. Foggarty won everything on a Ducati but failed to win anything on a RC45. If it is clear that one bike has a significant advantage and there is little chance of winning a championship on anything else the obvious thing to do is get a ride on that bike. The teams will naturally look for the best riders and the sponsors will support the teams they expect to win. It follows that the bike with the advantage will attract the riders and the sponsorship. The only thing that distorts this is if a team decides to offer a rider very large sums of wedge as Honda did with Faggarty and Yamaha with Rossi. It didn't work with Foggarty because the bike advantage was too great. It worked up to a point with Rossi because the rules of MotoGP were the same for all.

We will see as the season unfolds how much advantage the Vtwins derive from the rules and if the fours are able to compete. I'm not holding my breath as I suspect the rules have been formulated entirely for Ducati, in my lifetime I have seen the Italians manipulate rules for both car and bike racing quite bazenly. When I was an apprentice, back in the dark ages of the 60s Ferrari were in direct competition to BRMs, everytime BRM produced a winning car Ferrari would lobby for a change in the engine regs, they did this quite blatantly a number of times and got away with it each time.

But maybe I'm beeing too cynical.

Mike