Can you force leaning into corners whilst (front) braking?

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Jug
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Re: Can you force leaning into corners whilst (front) braking?

Post by Jug »

Yup.

Most of the time the penalty for your mistake is just a scare, when I started this thread (over a year ago) I was pondering whether I could teach myself to react better in an emergency/panic corner situation.
As a trail rider you learn pretty quickly to disable some of your panic reactions, especially the front brake, as it will mostly lead to a tumble. Now if you could train yourself to brake less and instead try to corner rather than just panic braking in a straight line... well I think you'd get away with it more often that not.
However, as yet I have not been successful... :mrgreen:
That one seems to be very hardwired. :shock:
1190 Adventure S, 990 Superduke, DRZ-400E - all the bases covered.
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TLS-Moose
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Re: Can you force leaning into corners whilst (front) braking?

Post by TLS-Moose »

Well, we finally seem to have got the thread in the direction you originally intended, and also confirmed all of us both have similar incidents and similar reactions to them.

It is a mental conditioning issue, and I agree one I have failed to overcome too. Quite often I feel my bike laughs at me for my lack of faith in it ......

I think one point to make is these should be "once in a blue moon" incidents, and if they are occurring on a regular basis you really need to look at your riding and why they're happening, rather than what to do when they do happen.
Of all the things I have ever lost, I miss my mind the most .....

Handle stressful situations like a dog - If you can't eat it or play with it, pee on it and walk away
podrick
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Re: Can you force leaning into corners whilst (front) braking?

Post by podrick »

TLS-Moose wrote: Oct 23rd, '18, 12:27 Sorry, have I suddenly happened across the DAM page? the responses I'm seeing here don't seem to relate to some of the rideouts I've been on. I seem to have encountered the twilight world of perfect riders ......

I'm pretty certain Mr Jug isn't talking about everyday riding and cornering, nor is he talking about track riding ...... he's talking about those once in a while "oops, I've fecked that up!" moments, or the half-way around a corner "Eek, where did that cow-pat/pothole/rock/gravel on my riding line come from" moments.

Now as has been said above, proper planning, reading the road ahead, riding within the distance you can stop in, etc, etc, is how we should and no doubt do, normally ride but no matter how good a rider we think we might be, I can guarantee we've all had the above moments, where the natural reaction is to skim the brakes, and thanks to dear old gyroscopic effect the bike tends to sit up a little punting you towards the hedge or oncoming traffic depending on the direction of the bend. When this happens and you're brain catches up with the trajectory of the bike your natural reaction at aiming for a solid object at a speed quicker than you'd like is to squeeze the brake that little bit harder (actually ones forearm is usually doing a good popeye impression). What Mr Jug is getting at, is when you are in this phase of reaction can you force the bike into the curve against its (and gravities) will or do you have to just suck it up and be a passenger along for the ride?

I've certainly found myself in a situation where encountering a thick layer of gravel from the centre of my lane out to the white line on a lefthand bend, I've ended up going between the passenger side of an oncoming car and the hedge. There was no way that application of the brake or forcing the bike harder into the bend would have helped in that instance - it would have just meant lowsiding into the side of the car. However, I do think it's something that can be learnt and even perhaps practised (if you have somewhere quiet and safe to practice). Just approach the chosen corner and try braking and leaning at the same time a few times to get a feel for how the bike responds, then try squeezing a little harder on the lever and seeing if it will still do (or can be made to do) what you want. One of the most important things, and I've also found the hardest, is teaching your brain not to automatically reach for the brake when you encounter something you hadn't anticipated.

Advanced riding, Bike Safe, (maybe even track riding), etc., etc., might all help prevent the discussed scenarios occurring, but I challenge every single person on this site to put their hand on their heart and say they haven't had a moment on a bend that hasn't got their heart beating a little faster or given cause for discussion at the next coffee stop .......
Sums it perfectly i reckon
MikeZ
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Re: Can you force leaning into corners whilst (front) braking?

Post by MikeZ »

Thought i would join in on this one. Daily road rider of 38 years, only been track daying for 6 years.
It is all about brain training so that what you consider to be your best option for the given condition becomes automatic, ie the body just does it.
There's always exceptions.
I practice the same thing on the same bit of road for months at a time, enjoy myself as usual, but when i get to my current 'learning point on the road' do the same as last time but try to be better. I find it really helps.
I have found, track days help because it gets me into that mindset by going round and round and watching those going quicker than me.
Track days have certainly helped me to corner better and understand how much more margin i have than i thought.
By the way I'm still not fast, but the key thing is i always enjoy it.
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