Filtering and undertaking

[Enigma]

Found this interesting article and thought I'd share

http://bikersnetwork.net/threads/filtering-laws.707/

[TheSpinDoctor]

I know TC and he knows his stuff. However, I do think that what he has said here needs some further explanation. As I explained in the article I wrote on my blog last October https://survivalskills.wordpress.com/20 ... recedents/ whilst magistrates' judgments (as in the examples quoted) are interesting to read, they don't constitute binding judgments on other incidents. Each case will be judged on its own merits and even in very similar circumstances magistrates do come to very different decisions.

He also says: "So is it legal to undertake? Well it is not illegal. The only offence open to the prosecution is either dangerous or careless driving, but to prove these offences it has to be proven beyond all reasonable doubt that the standard of driving fell well below that of a reasonably safe and competent driver, therefore the sole act of a nearside overtake is insufficient. However, weave from lane to lane at high speed, then it may be a different story."

A few years ago, I was listening to a talk by Nigel, a bike-riding police driver, to a group of motorcyclists. He'd just been on a training course and had been shown a video clip of a rider undertaking on the M23 near Gatwick. He was asked for his opinion of the rider, on a big BMW, moving through slower traffic by changing lane and undertaking in places and he said "no problem - could have left a bit more space on a couple of occasions but safe and smooth". So he was gobsmacked to discover that the police car had stopped the rider and prosecuted him for dangerous driving, and that on the basis of the police statements and video evidence the magistrate had found him guilty and handed down a 6 month ban. What we motorcyclists think is good and safe may not be what the non-biking majority think safe, or as in this case what a non-biking policeman considers safe. In the opinion of the police witness, the offence was committed, and that the police will usually be backed up by a non-riding magistrate!

"So this raises the question of "What if I decide to undertake and the car in the centre lane decides to move back into the inside lane? The driver in the centre lane however does commit the offence of driving without reasonable consideration for other road users (which is a subsection of careless driving), and they also have a statutory duty of care to ensure that it is safe to return to that lane before they actually start to change position."

Here we come down to what constitutes "reasonable consideration" and "beyond all reasonable doubt". If the driver can be shown to have been driving carefully in the preceding moments and says "I looked and I didn't see a bike" then it's going to be extremely difficult to prove "beyond all reasonable doubt" that the driver acted without any consideration for the biker - after all, it may not be illegal to pass on the left but the convention is to pass to the right.

[billinom8s]

I always thought that if a lane was travelling at a faster although still inside the speed limit then it wouldn't constitute an offence.
I did a bikesafe course a few years ago and the instructor stopped me as I was riding in traffic on the Devon link road at 60mph. He turned on the blues and two and asked what I was doing.
He them said that he knows and I know I wouldn't normally ride like that. Told me to be progressive but safe and not take the piss. 80mph later we are spending more time on the other side of the road than was probably the plan.

Also encouraged us to filter through towns.

[TLS-Moose]

"Filtering" and "Undertaking" are two very different things. The former is acceptable, as long as the speed differential is not too great. The latter, to the best of my knowledge is,and always has been, illegal. In this country we (only) overtake on the right.

Now, if in traffic the speed of flow is greater in a lefthand lane than it is on the right, then it is acceptable to continue with the flow, rather than hold everything up. It is not acceptable, however, to weave from lane to lane or deliberately pass a slower moving vehicle ahead of you by passing on the left hand side. This is not America, where you can wander around lanes as much as you like .......

See paragraph 268 here - https://www.gov.uk/motorways-253-to-273 ... 267-to-269" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Dailaughing]

If you see the comments attached to that original post I asked about rule 268 and the author claims there is no legal backing for that "no undertaking" rule. He does deal with filtering and undertaking totally separately with no clear answers to whether either is completely legal or not. That makes me think he knows what he is talking about as the law is rarely black or white.

[TLS-Moose]

I need my licence for work. Whether or not the .gov.uk site and the Highway Code (one and the same, really) is a legally enforceable document, it is a "code of practice" - i.e. if you follow what it says, you will be deemed to be riding within the law.

I can see that if the poop hits the fan are you are pulled over, you can try their argument in court but personally I'd rather not be in court in the first place! Its all a bit hit or miss if you ask me, and subject to the views of the copper on the day, or which magistrate/judge you get in court. Id rather not bet my livelihood, mortgage, and life on a maybe ..... especially given all official documents suggest otherwise ....

[Dailaughing]

subject to the views of the copper on the day, or which magistrate/judge you get in court

Sums up our legal system to me.

Was followed today from Falmouth to almost St Day including leaving the main drag and it was blatant they were on the hunt for me to make a mistake so they had an excuse but thankfully I didn't. They ended up pulling into a layby and trying to look innocent.

Mind you I could have had them for "without due care and attention" as they ran up within a couple of bike lengths of me a couple of times when they failed to slow for a speed limit in time. It was almost fun playing with them apart from the fact they hold all the power.

[Kata]

Probably bored and looking for doughnuts...

[MellowYellow]

We've several roads round these parts with 'no entry' signs.
Then, underneath they moronic mayor's denizens have added a rectangular 'except for buses' signs.

Nonsense...it's either 'no entry' or it's not. All the buses are breaking the law and should be prosecuted.

Oh! and the cyclists...again.

[TLS-Moose]

Probably bored and looking for doughnuts...

Are you calling Dailaughing a donut??